Missing this BOD discussion could cost you dearly. This week we give you an amazingly simple tool to immediately boost your spending power and control. We also give you a highly effective way of asking for a discount.
Watch Discussion (13min, 28MB)
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23 Responses to this post
September 23, 2009 at 3:38 am |
Negotiation, interesting subject. It can be sometimes good to negotiate and look for a discount but there are cases were I would skip negotiation.
For example when I work with my voice over guys I try to pay theme there requested fee if the project fits it. What I get in return is a high quality service and quick turnaround times. This builds up thrust what can be really important in online business.
In my opinion if I can keep the people who I work with happy I will always have more to win than those extra few discount dollars.
Also in my experience, clients who every time try to negotiate the lowest price can actually be more difficult to work with later, when the project starts.
September 23, 2009 at 3:45 am |
Hi Gyorfi,
I agree that there are cases when negotiation can be skipped, as long as you are paying the “right” price for a service. Best, John.
September 23, 2009 at 3:45 am |
Hey Gyorfi,
Thanks for your input. Yes, it’s very wise to not destroy trust in a perfectly functional business relationship by pushing for discounts. There’s an old saying in negotiating, ‘never lick the plate clean’. It has to be fair and equitable for both parties.
When it comes to purchasing commodities and business supplies e.g. bulk paper etc, I’m always pleasantly surprised how many companies will offer a better deal (if only you ask).
Best, Robin
September 23, 2009 at 3:56 am |
HI Guys,
this is the first time I don´t agree a 100% with the discussion. In short you say “Get only the new tools if you can do more profit with it right away”. But sometimes it ain´t that easy – for example if you wan´t/must learn a new software/technique which could increase your profits, you first have to invest into those new tools, learn them and then make money out of them. For example I bought the whole Trapcode suite for about half the price (disscount). I couldn´t use the software profitable in the first 3 months because I first had to understand how it all works. But nowadays I use them in about 70% of my projects and I make profit out of it! I think this is such an steady evolving business that you sometimes have to follow some trends to not lose the pace. Of course most of the products which are offered as a “must have” make no sense at all – If you just think 5 seconds about you will see that. But in some cases it´s necessary to grow your business.
September 23, 2009 at 4:17 am |
Hi illd,
Great to have your input into the discussion. You raise an important point. The example you give makes perfect sense – investing on the premise that you “could” increase your profits.
Ultimately, it boils down to sound commercial judgment. Things to consider:
a) if you already have clients, you will be in a better position to judge your ability to realise profit from your investment. Consider the opposite case, where enthusiastic business starters spend up big, with no sign of a customer anywhere;
b) only you will know whether of not your real intention is to be totally committed to recouping your investment with a client in the short-term. You obviously are. Others aren’t. They buy for fun or to stay up-to-date, with no clear or present commercial path to profit;
c) commercially, my preference would always be to have secured the job first, then invest in the new technology/software etc. to deliver the result for the client. This may not always be possible, but having a firm, commercial mindset works hard to preserve company profits. In my experience, most people tend to want to spend first, sell later (if at all).
Best to you and your business,
Robin
September 23, 2009 at 5:34 am |
Hi Robin,
thanks for your great advices. You say investing on the premise that you “could” increase your profits make sense.
). Sometimes it´s really a thin line between “I never should ahave charged this stuff” and “Luckily I invested in that a time ago – now I can profit by it”.
To me that is the biggest issue on investing in new “stuff”. Sometimes it´s really hard to estimate the chance of increasing the profits on new investments.
Heres an example: I heard through the grapevine that a big Production House (probably in 2 months from there) are looking for a lot of artists with “matchmove” skills. At that time I had not much jobs going on, so I decided to learn this technique. I bought me the right books and the software and invested a lot of time on learning. Unfortunately the production house got cancelled the project. Clearly a money-losing business to me, because my regular customers usually don´t need such techniques. I estimated I will get this job, but I made non profit out of it because I judged the situation wrong. In the end, one of my regular customers asked me about matchmoving – right here, right now. I told him I could do this but I have to charge a higher rate by the hour than usuall.
Although my investment isn´t paid off already and the decission was made out of the wrong reasons – In the end it was the right decission (I hope
September 23, 2009 at 9:05 am |
Thanks guys. Classic episode. Really needed to hear that advice because I do like to buy new toys just for the sake of having them! Well done.
September 23, 2009 at 3:28 pm |
Thanks for your feedback, Kyle.
New toys can be so tempting and a lot of fun to play with. Even more fun is having a ‘lean, mean profit making machine’ that fills your personal bank account with after tax profit. Then you can do some serious spending, and have the free time to enjoy your toys!
Best to you, Robin
September 24, 2009 at 1:34 pm |
Tried watching the video but it cuts off in the middle. Wondering if anyone else is having that problem.
September 24, 2009 at 1:44 pm |
Hi Dan, just checked it here and plays back fine for me. All the best, John.
September 24, 2009 at 11:02 pm |
Hi guys,
Just wanted to say how much I enjoy these podcasts. They’re really very good indeed. Keep up the great work.
Markos.
September 24, 2009 at 11:53 pm |
Great to hear Mark, thanks for taking the time to let us know. All the best, John.
September 26, 2009 at 6:48 am |
Hi,
I agree with Mark Shingleton, and I thank both of you for these inspiring pieces of advice.
About this episode, I’m not quite at ease with the idea of looking for discounts for everything you buy.
Actually, I’m currently sick of all the discounts people are asking me.
Being cheap is never enough. You must go cheaper. Being just PAID seems to be too much for some clients.
And that’s not a question of bad work, they tell me my work is great, it’s in the deadlines….
We’re living in the “Discount Era”, or “Cheap Era”… everything must be cheaper than cheap, all the time. From this point of view, that’s mediocre times… :-/
And we’re now entering the “Free Era”, or to be more accurate, the “NoCharge Era”… As I said, some people have plenty of work to give you… for free !
And it’s hardly a joke.
And in the same time, I admit I like to have discounts, I also like free stuff on the web…
But in this greedy period, do we have to be greedy all the time ?
Of course I want to have money, to earn more etc. But things I buy have a worth, and so do my work also.
It’s a crisis of worth…
September 27, 2009 at 12:19 am |
Bonjour Boreale,
Comment allez vous?
Your comment about discounting is very important and I want to make my position on this subject very clear.
The purpose of BOD (Business of Design) is to help all of you highly talented and creative people design, develop and grow a business that works i.e. makes you the money you are worth, and is a joy to do.
With this in mind, with regard to discounting my thoughts are:
a) Giving discounts: as someone who has never given a discount in their professional life, I will be working hard to help BOD subscribers maximize their profit by getting the highest possible prices for their work and not have to discount;
b) Getting discounts: as someone who is continually surprised by the number of suppliers who are prepared to give you a discount (if only you’d ask), I will be urging BOD subscribers to seek every opportunity to maximize their profit by lowering their input costs – this includes asking for a discount i.e. where appropriate, and in a way that is respectful.
I hope all goes well for you Boreale. Thank-you for your contribution into this important conversation.
Au revoir,
Best, Robin
September 29, 2009 at 12:01 pm |
Merci Robin !
I’ll try to ask for discounts more often , to see if it works…
You write :
“…asking for a discount i.e. where appropriate”
That’s the point : how do we define where it is appropriate ?
Here’s my 2 cents : I can ask for a discount if there’s not a big difference between the discount price and the worth I give to the object/service, or its usefulness for me.
But if we’re always looking for maximizing our profit, we never donate on the web… never when we can choose to give or not… Not very fair I guess… Somewhat too greedy for me.
Best,
October 5, 2009 at 1:42 pm |
Boreale, your participation in this conversation adds value.
Thank-you.
Regarding donation on the web, I would add…
The decision of whether or not to donate is driven by one’s values. The capacity to be able to donate is more a function of one’s financial situation.
If a company is thriving from a financial perspective (maximizing profit) it is in a very strong position to generously contribute profits to worthy causes. Companies that struggle financially are less equipped to be able to ‘donate’.
Regarding discounts…
It’s appropriate to ask for a discount if you believe that the vendor has room to negotiate, has the authority (or can get the authority) to approve the discount, and has a precedence for lowering their prices.
My rule is, if in doubt – ask anyway (in a polite and genuine way).
Best, Robin
October 17, 2009 at 2:46 am |
Great Tip!
I realized there is a lot to learn regarding business.
For me it’s really easy to forget about the business site of that industry/”my company”.
And I like to spend money for these things.
Thanks for the video tip!
Regards
Grischa
October 17, 2009 at 6:29 pm |
Hi Grischa, it’s so easy to spend money in our industry as well. There’s always new computers, software and gadgets we “need”! Best, John.
October 18, 2009 at 1:34 pm |
Hey John and Robin
Well I finaly got proactive (the verb not the face wash) and sent my showreel in to a bunch of places last week, had an interview at one of the major studios (here in NZ) a couple of days later and now have a new job with them.
October 18, 2009 at 2:36 pm |
That’s fantastic news Aidan, congratulations. Do you mind if I use this in the Testimonials column on the BOD page? Best, John.
October 18, 2009 at 3:09 pm |
Not at all, thats fine.
It’s an editing role for shortland st,our 7pm weeknight drama/soap. Even tho I wont be doing online editing for quite a while the guy doing the interview was impressed with grading I acheived using magic bullet looks for a music video I shot.
It’s really just a starting point for my career but it makes my happy knowing that if I had of kept up with my directing and writing major at uni, I would have been finishing my final year about now. I would not have been able to buy my own computer and after effects, learnt what I have, made the things I have made nor found http://www.motionworks.com.au to help me know what to do with it all.
(Early days but I’m hoping to design the opening credits in the future
)
October 19, 2009 at 12:12 am |
Thanks aidan, good on you for getting out there and making it happen. All the best, John.
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